Only In Israel

Friday, September 17, 2004

Fighting Israelbashers on IRC

Those of you who know me know I can be found in various political channels, especially in Undernet's #politics under the nick IDFguy19. I like to go in there, and have a debate with people. The problem is, occasionaly, whiny, disgusting people, whose goal isn't debate but spreading hatered and confusion show up and try to mess it up.
Anyway, today I had a debate with someone in #political who tried to pain israel as China's best pal around it started like this:

CowTippa:Israel's role in China's new warplane - by David Isenberg -

IDFguy19: CowTippa. israel has indeed sold, in the past (early-mid 90s) it's military technologies and equipment to china. not US technologies, not US equipment, and not anymore.

Cowtippa: "Israel ranks second only to Russia as a weapons-system provider to China and as a conduit for sophisticated military technology, followed by France and Germany," stated a report this year by the US-China Security Review Commission, a panel established by Congress to examine security and economic relations between the two countries.

This is where I noticed something is wrong. puting that quote into google resulted a bunch of conspiracy sites. Including one trying to convince me of alien abductions and jewish mind control and a Nazimedia "article".

So I did a simple thing. I searched for "US-China Security Review Commission". Found their site, and in their site search searched for the quote. Can you guess what happened?

IDFguy19: CowTippa. how about we try a nice neat trick OK?

IDFguy19: we go to the US-China Security Comission and search for the quote in the article.

IDFguy19: ok?


IDFguy19: there's the site

IDFguy19: now let's put in the quote

Cowtippa: trick indeed

IDFguy19: Searching for "Israel ranks second only to Russia as a weapons-system provider to China and as a conduit for sophisticated military technology".

IDFguy19: No documents matching your query were found.

You'd expect the guy to get he was wrong, right? Well, no.

Cowtippa: IDFguy19: so what, USCC didn't put the Asia Times article online

IDFguy19: ofcourse CowTippa. but USCC is quoted in the Asia Times article, and it's in fact the only quote which currently connects Israel to china, in the year 2002. the quote isn't real and in fact NON-Existant.

IDFguy19: CowTippa. if the quote is real, then the report would be on their site. it isn't. the article lied. you know that. admit it.

Cowtippa: IDFguy19: nope

Cowtippa: it probably just doesn't index their PDFs or their search engine is broken

Cowtippa: who knows

IDFguy19: CowTippa.. oh. OK. google searches PDF's as well.

IDFguy19: let's try the same thing on google

IDFguy19: here

IDFguy19: Your search - "Israel ranks second only to Russia " - did not match any documents.

So there, I proved that no government reports containing the citation in Asiatimes existed. You think it'll make the Israel-bashers leave in peace and admit an error? Hell NO!

Cowtippa: Israeli officials claim that one benefit of its sale of LAVI fighter technology to China has been to prevent sales of surface-to-surface missiles to Israel's neighbors.[42] However, in mid-1996, the CIA reportedly disclosed that China may have shipped 'missile-related components' to Syria.

Cowtippa: IDFguy19: the title is "A Report for the U.S.-China Economic and Security Review Commission"

IDFguy19: no CowTippa.. that's not the title

IDFguy19: This is :Foreign Military Acquisitions and PLA Modernization Testimony of Richard D. Fisher, Jr., Center for Security Policy Before the U.S.-China Economic and Security Review Commission.

IDFguy19: CowTippa. this is what Dr-S provided.

The he tried to whine and compare the "report" to a "testimony" and claim that the Google Cache had the testimony labeled as "report for" (well DUH. when I make a typo on this site, I edit it, and google might keep the old version of it. so what?). In short, it went downhill from there, and the moron degenerated into calling me an idiot, full of crap, ETC. Not that it mattered I've made my point.

Conclusions for today:

  • Israeli bashers and truth are like fire and water.
  • Never expect to allow logic to beat the basher's desire to lie.
  • Thank God for google.


  • Those idiots are riduculous, their hatered blinds them. And the sad thing is, they won't give up even after proven wrong.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 8:54 PM, September 17, 2004  

  • Quote from the testimony:

    "Even though Israel apparently has stopped its military exports to the PRC, it remains the second most important source of advanced military technology to the PRC due to its cumulative effect."

    In other words, Israel is no longer selling ANYTHING military to China. Not only that, but...

    "During the late 1970s and early 1980s, the United States encouraged Israel to develop military technical ties with the PRC in order to indirectly aid PRC military modernization against the former Soviet Union."

    Israel's trade with China was not only consented to by the U.S., it was encouraged! Someone tell this guy he should be plotting the overthrow of America's government, not Israel's.

    By Blogger Eliyak, at 2:24 AM, September 24, 2004  

  • cowtippa is a communist bigoted fuck, he still chats on undernet and still is a piece of shit

    By Anonymous monchie is a whore, at 3:39 PM, August 22, 2008  

  • Its 2009 and I just ran across your blog defaming Cowtippa
    I checked out the issue and guess what I found.

    To wit
    "The J-10's airframe, or body, is based on a design for an Israeli fighter called the Lavi," said Shlomo Aronson, a political science professor at Hebrew University in Jerusalem.

    Israel first developed the Lavi with help from the U.S. government and aerospace makers in the 1980s under a joint project. It was designed to counter Soviet planes like the MiG-29 that were then being supplied to Arab nations.

    Some of the the Lavi's internal weapons, navigation, communications and other technology were based on the U.S. F-16. The Lavi was also powered by an engine supplied by General Electric. (GE) Some major features of the Lavi's airframe also were based on the F-16.

    The U.S. later broke with the project after Israel stated its intention to export the plane. U.S. officials believed the Lavi would vie against export models of the F-16.

    Israeli plans to develop the Lavi were dumped as a result. But by the 1990s, the Israelis were trying to sell the design for Lavi to the Chinese government, which was developing the J-10.

    The U.S. blocked the Israel-China deal, saying the plane's internal systems were based on top-secret U.S. technology.

    "The Americans," Aronson noted, didn't object to Israel selling the Lavi's airframe to China, "but they did object to seeing advanced radar (and other systems) going to China." In the end, only the Lavi's airframe was used in the new Chinese fighter.

    Aronson says the Chinese also got pointers from Israel in making the J-10 operate in hot, arid desert conditions. He says parts of Israel and China have similar climates. The Israelis have technology that keeps planes flying in such weather."
    A political scientist in Israel seems to think the J-10 has its genersis in the Lavi. And yes the evidence is sparse but hey its Israel you arent exactly known for openess on other issues like Israels nuclear weapons and israel supplying tech to China obviously was a sensitive issue in the USA.
    Anyway stick to the script its really not that big an issue to me

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at 7:32 PM, September 01, 2009  

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